Today, I'm excited to introduce our special guest, Jess Van Den. Jess is a self-employed silversmith and the creative force behind the Ethereal label. Since 2008, she has transformed her jewelry-making hobby into a thriving business and now helps others do the same through her platforms, Create and Thrive and the Thriver Circle.

Join us as Jess shares her journey from hobbyist to full-time business owner, offering practical tips and heartfelt advice on turning your passion into a successful venture.

Mentioned In This Episode

• How to get in touch with Jess and check out her jewelry: ⁠Website, ⁠Free Gift: ⁠FREE Handmade Business Toolkit⁠

• Get on the HobbyScool email list and be the first to know when our next online learning summit opens! Sign up here: ⁠https://newsletter.hobbyscool.com/profile

The Journey from Hobby to Business

Jess started her journey into jewelry making as a hobby in 2008. Like many hobbyists, she enjoyed the creative process and soon found herself with more jewelry than she could ever need. Jess' first step into the business world was setting up an Etsy shop, a platform that was relatively new at the time. She recalls the excitement of her first sale, which came about a month after opening her shop. This initial success fueled her passion and set the stage for her transition from hobbyist to full-time entrepreneur in 2010.

Establishing a Niche

Finding a niche is crucial for standing out in the crowded handmade market. Jess emphasizes the importance of experimentation in the early stages. "Don't stress too much about getting it perfect from the beginning," she advises. Jess experimented with various styles and techniques before developing her signature style. She encourages new makers to play around with different ideas and refine their niche over time. This approach not only helps in discovering what resonates with customers but also allows for the development of a unique brand identity.

The Importance of Good Photography

One of the biggest challenges in selling handmade products online is capturing high-quality photographs. Jess stresses that excellent photos are non-negotiable. "Bad photos are the death knell of an online business," she warns. Good photography not only showcases the product effectively but also communicates professionalism and attention to detail. Jess recommends investing time and resources into learning basic photography skills or hiring a professional photographer to ensure that products are presented in the best possible light.

Growing and Sustaining Your Business: Expanding Beyond Etsy

Pricing is a common stumbling block for many handmade sellers. Jess admits that underpricing is a mistake she sees frequently. Many makers only consider the cost of materials and a small amount for their time, but this approach is unsustainable. "You need to pay yourself for the admin work and the marketing work, not just the time you spend making the item," Jess explains.

She advises makers to factor in all aspects of their business operations to ensure they are making a profit. Competing on price alone is a race to the bottom, especially in the handmade industry where quality and uniqueness should be the primary selling points.

Building a Supportive Community

Running a handmade business can be isolating, but Jess has created a supportive community through her Thriver Circle membership. She emphasizes the value of connecting with other makers who understand the unique challenges of the handmade business. "It's really lovely to have a group of people and a mentor that can guide you through the process," Jess notes. Community support provides not only practical advice but also emotional encouragement, which is vital for long-term success.

Final Thoughts and Encouragement

Jess’ journey from hobbyist to successful entrepreneur is a testament to the potential of turning a passion into a thriving business. She leaves us with a few parting words of encouragement: "Give it a go. You only have one life. If you have this dream, go for it. It's a marathon, not a sprint. Be patient and keep pushing forward."

Conclusion

Jess’ story is a powerful reminder that with creativity, perseverance, and the right strategies, anyone can transform their passion into a successful venture. Remember to embrace the process, experiment, and connect with supportive communities along the way.

If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe and leave a review. Stay tuned for more episodes featuring inspiring stories and practical tips to help you on your hobby-to-business journey. Keep creating and thriving!

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Transcript:

Dr. Destini Copp [00:00:49]:

And my special guest today is Jess Van Den. Jess is a self employed silversmith working under the Ethereal label. She's been making jewelry since 2008 when she opened up her own Etsy shop to sell her jewelry as a hobby and then turned this into a full time occupation in 2010. She is also the founder of Create and Thrive and the Thriver Circle where she teaches fellow makers how to turn their hobby into a thriving business. And, Jess, thank you so much for joining me. I know we're gonna have a great conversation here. But before we get into the all the questions I have for you, can you tell the good audience just a little bit more about you and how you help people?

Jess Van Den [00:01:44]:

Absolutely. Thanks so much for having me, Destini. So, yeah, I got into this as a hobby like many people do. I'm not really expecting to do anything with it. And then just kind of accidentally turned into a full time job for me, which was lovely. And a few years into making jewelry, you know, I was getting involved in the community, local community and the online community. And I was actually a teacher before all of this, a school teacher. So people kept asking me, how did you do this? How did you do that? And I'm like, well, I should just put something together to help people learn how to, you know, get their online business up and running with their their craft.

Jess Van Den [00:02:20]:

So that's when I created Set Up Shop, which I'm still running to this day. I've been running with that for over 10 years now and it's a course that kind of guides you through step by step all the little things you need to do to set up a successful shop online no matter where you wanna sell. And that was the beginning of kind of me teaching and helping other makers get their businesses up and running. And I've been doing that as long as, sorry, as long side running my jewelry business ever since. And a few years into the process, I thought there's a I wanted to create more community. So that's when I started the Thrivers Circle to create a really supportive, lovely community of people who are all on the same page. Because, you know, when you, when you kind of work alone at home, it can get really isolating and you don't necessarily have someone who understands what you're trying to achieve, so it's really lovely to have a group of people and a mentor that can guide you through that process.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:03:09]:

So I have a lot of questions for you, but first, I wanna I want you to take us back to 2,008 when you were just starting out making this jewelry, on your own. What did you do to start selling it? How did you what what are some of the first steps that you took there?

Jess Van Den [00:03:27]:

Well, I tried everything in the beginning. You know, I tried markets. I tried wholesale. I tried online consignment, all all the different bits and pieces because I didn't I didn't know what would be most successful. But I honestly, I started with Etsy. That was that was where I started because I was making all this jewelry. I was like, there's there's more jewelry than ironically, I'm not a big jewelry wearer, or at least I wasn't at the time. It was just I was enjoying the making process.

Jess Van Den [00:03:54]:

And I'm like, this is more jewelry than I could ever need. What can I do with it? Maybe I can sell a bit and recoup a bit of my costs. And, well, I I'd actually thought I thought I could start my own website and I stumbled across Etsy. And Etsy was really new then. It was like 2 years in or something. And I'm like, oh, this is a perfect solution. I don't have to do it myself. I can just set up on this platform that's designed for what I want.

Jess Van Den [00:04:22]:

So I opened my shop on there and it took me about a month to get my first sale. I I still remember the moment I got my first sale and how exciting it was. The idea that somebody wanted to buy something I made. And, yeah, it just kind of it stayed as a hobby for about a year and a half. And then I was learning so much from other people and, you know, I decided, okay, well, things happen in my life. It's a really long story. I won't go into it. It's not a bad story.

Jess Van Den [00:04:50]:

But long story short, I ended up going full time with my business and kind of never looked back from there. So it took me a long time to really hit on what my business was about. Like, it took me years to really develop my signature style of my jewelry. And so something I'd say to people in the beginning is don't stress too much about like getting it perfect from the beginning. You know, when you're when you're just starting out, you probably have a lot of different ideas, a lot of different things you wanna experiment with. So, you know, experiment with them at the beginning when nobody's really paying attention and and sort of see what what works for you, what works for your potential customers. And over time, you'll be able to narrow things down into a niche or even a micro niche, which is like a very, very narrow specific type of thing and just play around with it and and and experiment. And, yes, you know, branding is important.

Jess Van Den [00:05:43]:

Having everything looking professional is important. But I think, you know, experiment a little bit in the beginning first to sort of get a feel for what you wanna do before you spend too much time or money trying to perfect that sort of branding stuff because it will come with time as well and experience.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:06:00]:

So you mentioned that you went full time in it, and I believe that was around 2010. Correct?

Jess Van Den [00:06:04]:

Mhmm. That's right. Yep.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:06:05]:

Alright. Then then you, you know, brought your husband Nick in to to help you with it. Now at that point in time, you're still you're still selling on Etsy. And and I don't even know the answer to this. Are you still selling on Etsy today or did you

Jess Van Den [00:06:18]:

I am.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:06:19]:

Build your own store with your jewelry?

Jess Van Den [00:06:22]:

Yeah. I am still selling on Etsy, but I do have my own website and I have for a very long time. So I have I have a ferial.com, my own website, which is a WooCommerce website, which I set up, gosh, 12, 13 years ago now. Long time ago now. So yeah, I do sell on both platforms. I used to sell on a lot more platforms as well. Like back in the late 2000, there was a lot more variety of of handmade business website, handmade websites out there. There was Artfire.

Jess Van Den [00:06:48]:

There was the Wanda in Europe. There was here in Australia that's made it, which is still in existence. So I used to sell on a lot of different venues. And the reason I did that, of course, is because I wanted to get my jewelry in front of as many people as possible to increase my chances of making a sale. So, you know, that is another good reason to sort of diversify where you sell.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:07:08]:

And I I really I'm just curious. This is kinda just, you know, coming in my mind. I'm just curious, you know, since you have so much experience. Right? You've sold on all of those different handmade websites. You're selling on Etsy today. You have your own store. You're on your WooCommerce platform. What would you recommend for somebody just starting out? Where would you recommend that they start?

Jess Van Den [00:07:32]:

Look, despite its issues, Etsy is still a good place to start because it is very affordable and very simple. You know, they guide you through the process of setting up a shop and you do benefit from being on a platform where they will bring you traffic. I do still recommend if people don't have any web design experience that to start on Etsy. And then if you want to branch out from there, it really comes down to your comfort level with creating a website and also what you want out of it. Like, I generally just say to people, the simplest option is Shopify because it's it's meant and it's set up to be an ecommerce solution for you? It's not particularly affordable. It can get quite expensive, but, you know, you've got to spend a bit of money to make money as they say. And, you know, you can potentially do like I've done, you know, a WordPress, WooCommerce website, but that's a lot more complicated. I mean, it's a lot simpler than it used to be, but it's still a lot more complicated.

Jess Van Den [00:08:30]:

There's also Squarespace and Wix and other places, but Shopify is kind of the premier option if you want the best option to set up, an online shop, which has all the bells and whistles available to you.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:08:43]:

And I would say, you know, I have 2 Shopify stores. Now I don't sell handmade products there. I have digital products there. And I would say that, you know, I'm I'm I don't consider myself a web designer, but I was able to figure it out. So I definitely think that is that is doable there. So, definitely, what you're recommending is to start out on Etsy and depending on what their goals are to expand. Walk us through kind of the process. If somebody is, you know, starting out on SC, when would they know that they're ready to expand or maybe explore other options like setting up their own shop? Well,

Jess Van Den [00:09:22]:

I mean, I'm a big fan of if you got a real business, you know, you're serious about this, you're growing business that you should have your own standalone website because, you know, you own the real estate. Then you have a place that's yours. You're not relying on a third party like Etsy for your secure the security of your business. But, you know, at what point do you make that leap? It's it's going to be different for everybody, but you definitely the good thing about Etsy and another thing that I reason I recommend it is because it's a good training ground for your business. So if you can compete on Etsy, you you know that you probably are gonna do okay because you've got to have really great photos. You've got to have excellent titles. You've got to have good customer service. You know, all of those basics of running a successful business, you know, by setting up on Etsy and getting started and and growing your business there.

Jess Van Den [00:10:11]:

It'll you'll learn how to do all of those things because it's a different level of difficulty to run a business and direct people to your own website. The thing about Etsy is if you do well on the platform, you don't necessarily have to drive any traffic yourself outside of the platform. You can just get sales from the platform completely up to you to drive traffic. And that's a whole another level of difficulty and complexity and marketing knowledge and experience and experimentation that you need to learn. So, you know, if you start on it, seeing get the basics of running your business set up, that's a good start. And you can kind of start to work out how you're gonna market your business outside of the platform. And that's the point where you can potentially set up your own website and and start driving traffic there instead of Etsy.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:11:09]:

Would you say that if they start out on essay and then decide, you know, I want to, you know, take the leap, right, set up my own job, that they should still keep their Etsy store going.

Jess Van Den [00:11:19]:

I mean, I would, but that's just because I get a lot of sales there. You know, my business is my livelihood. So I've gotta I've gotta be where the money is, you know? So that's why I've, you know, just again, despite the problems with Etsy over the years, that's why I'm still there. It still gives me a good income and it still works for me. So I haven't left the platform. And it's really a personal choice. You know, if you're doing well enough off the platform and you don't want to be on there anymore, then great. You can you can move on.

Jess Van Den [00:11:48]:

But, you know, to this day, it really still is the place people go when they think about handmade. They go and they look on Etsy. And if you're not there, they can't find you.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:11:58]:

Yeah. I would say that I love Etsy, and I love to buy handmade gifts. And that's the place that I go to search for them.

Jess Van Den [00:12:05]:

So Mhmm. Yep.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:12:06]:

So let's say that somebody's out there. They they're a handmade crafter or, you know, they're making something that's handmade. How will they know that they have a good chance of being successful on Etsy? What research should they do in the beginning?

Jess Van Den [00:12:22]:

Well, start by just hopping on there and and looking for what you make and see what pops up. You know? Look at look at the competition and see how many, you know, how many people are making similar things, what sort of price point are they selling at, what do their photos look like, what do their shops look like? You know, their branding, their story they're telling. We can even go over and look in their social media and and and have a look at how they're doing over there. I'm not a huge fan of paying paying attention to competitors once you're up and running. I think sometimes that can negatively impact people. You know, some especially like don't follow people closely who make stuff really similar to you because then you get the, oh, no, they've made something. And now I can't make something that looks like that because I've seen it from someone else sort of issue pop up. But, you know, when you're just starting out and you're not quite sure, definitely have a look, do some research, see what else is out there.

Jess Van Den [00:13:14]:

And a good thing to remember is that just because what actually, if lots of people are making what you're making, that's actually a good thing because it shows there's a market for it. You know, if you're making something and nobody else is making it, you've got one of 2 options. 1, you're making something nobody wants or 2, you're so yeah. 1, you're making something nobody wants. And in that case, then you're gonna have the hard time or you've got an amazing innovative product that nobody knows they need yet. You just have to teach them that they would need it. So that's kind of a market opportunity there. But I see people go like, oh, there's so many jewelry shops on it too.

Jess Van Den [00:13:49]:

There's so many ceramicists. You know, how can I ever compete? Well, you compete by being yourself and you compete by creating something unique to you that only you can create. And, yes, it might look a little bit like somebody else's, but that doesn't mean there's not space for you as well.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:14:03]:

And especially in the handmade market. Right? Because we're all unique and we're all creating things that are just a little bit unique to us. Let me ask you this. You have your, you know, your membership. You have a lot of students in your program. So I'm sure you've seen people make mistakes. And you've you know, I'm sure you've made them yourself. Oh, yeah.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:14:21]:

Can you walk us through some of the mistakes that you see other people making as they start to explore, you know, basically turning their hobby into a a money making business?

Jess Van Den [00:14:33]:

Oh, yeah. There's so many so many I made, so many I see. It's it's it's quite funny, like, most of us make the same mistakes. You know? One of the things is definitely from the beginning, having a bit of a having a lack of clarity about what your business is actually about. And that's, you know, that's sort of the hobbyist mentality where you're making lots of different things You're making strictly for yourself for your own enjoyment, but you're giving no thought to the customer experience and and what the customer wants. So that's a big mindset shift you have to make when you start to sell your work is to think, okay, I need to start thinking, what do my customers want? What do my need? And how can I communicate to them why this will be a good thing for them? And that communication comes through number of things that it can come through, you know, that narrowing down your focus in your niche. As I said earlier, it comes through your photography. You know, bad photos are the definite of an online business.

Jess Van Den [00:15:32]:

You've got to have good photos. That is number 1 nonnegotiable is excellent photos to stand out. You know, you don't need a white background, especially when you're selling handmade. You can do whatever you want, but you have to have excellent photos that make your product stand out and make them your product the star of the show. You need to not underprice yourself. This is another huge mistake everybody pretty much makes in the beginning is that we underprice because we again, we're just like, oh, well, I'm covering my materials cost and maybe a little bit of time. And that is not enough if you want to have a sustainable business because you not only need to pay yourself to make the item, you need to pay yourself to sell the item, to do the marketing, to do the work. And the way I frame this normally for people is I go, okay, if you were selling wholesale, you sell for 50% of your retail price.

Jess Van Den [00:16:21]:

What's that other 50%? The the person who's selling your work, they're paying, you know, to sell your work, to to have the shop, to do the marketing and all that sort of stuff. So you've got to do the same thing. You know, that's why you have to sell a full retail price online because you need to pay yourself for the admin work and the marketing work, not just the time you spend making the item. So that is a really important thing. And, you know, competing on prices are right to the bottom. And especially in the handmade industry, it's just not something we can do and have a sustainable business. Yes, we need to be somewhat competitive, but at the same time we need to make sure we're making a product that we can sell at a profit. And this is another problem that I see a lot of people come up against, especially people who have crafts that take a long time, like quilters, knitters, things like that.

Jess Van Den [00:17:07]:

If your craft takes many, many, many hours to make, you have to sell it at a high price point or you you just can't have a sustainable business. And that might mean you need to alter a little bit what you make and change it in some ways, speed up the process or whatever it might be. There's generally a solution to that. So those are some of the biggest mistakes I peep people like. And I think another one which is a little bit more amorphous is, you know, a lack of confidence in your own abilities to figure this out. And you've got to believe in yourself. If you want to have a successful business, you have to be the one driving it. You have to be the one pushing it forward.

Jess Van Den [00:17:42]:

You have to believe in yourself and believe in the value of your product. Because if you don't believe in it, you can how are you going to convince other people to believe in it as well? So those are just a few little things.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:17:53]:

Well, I think they're they're all good. They're all good. As you were going through them, I'm like, yes. Yes. Yes. I agree with them all. Especially the pricing one. Because I think especially us women, we always tend to underprice.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:18:04]:

And Uh-huh. You just really don't have the the marketing and some of the admin stuff is really a lot more costly and time consuming than what you would think it would be.

Jess Van Den [00:18:14]:

Oh, yeah.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:18:15]:

So, Jess, any last minute thoughts before we wrap it up here?

Jess Van Den [00:18:21]:

Well, I'm just a big fan of giving it a go. You know, you only have one life. If you have this dream, go for it. Give it a crack. Like, what's the worst that can happen? It doesn't work out. Okay. Well, at least you tried and you gave it a go and, you know, you put everything into it. And my my the thing I always say and I've always said to people is it's a marathon, not a sprint.

Jess Van Den [00:18:42]:

You know, if you're in this, be in it for the long haul, be prepared that it will take time, be patient. Just because it's taking time doesn't mean you're doing it wrong. It takes time for everybody. It takes time to learn. It takes time to develop your your products. It takes time to work out how to sell stuff. It all of this stuff takes time and effort and energy. And we only have so much time in the day.

Jess Van Den [00:19:04]:

You know, if you've got another job, if you've got a family to take care of, if you've got other responsibilities, just keep going. If this is something you wanna do, keep going. Keep experimenting with it. Keep pushing forward and keep trying. And it is possible, you know, there's there's a lot of people out there like myself who are, you know, doing this and who are making money out of selling their craft, whether it's, you know, enough to save for a holiday or enough to pay one, one of the bills or maybe it's enough to make a full time living. And, you know, you, again, you can choose. It's up to you how much effort you want to put in, how much money you want to get out of this. And so do do what you want to do.

Jess Van Den [00:19:44]:

Do the business you want to have. Create the life you want to have. And most of the people who come into the Thrivers Circle, almost everybody says the same thing about what they want. It's I want freedom. I want to be creative and do something, put something beautiful or meaningful out into the world. I want to be my own boss or I want to have charge of my time. You know, that's one of the beautiful things about having your own business beautiful and terrifying is that you it's all up to you. It's all down to you.

Jess Van Den [00:20:15]:

And, you are the one who will make it happen.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:20:20]:

So, Jess, thank you so much for those inspiring thoughts. I love I love everything that you said there. Before we hang up here, can you let the audience know where they can find you? And I believe you have a free gift for them also.

Jess Van Den [00:20:33]:

Yes. So the best place to find me is online at createandthrive.com. From there, you can check out my YouTube channel, my podcast, all my courses, my membership, the Thrivers Circle and everything else. And if you I'm gonna give Destini a link that you can head over to and get some access to my handmade business toolkit. And inside there, I have a stack of freebies that will help you to get your business up and running. Things like Etsy keyword planner to help you figure out the best keywords used in your Etsy shop. There's an Etsy quick start guide available in there as well. So, you know, if you you wanna make sure that you're getting started with Etsy and not missing any of the important little details, and there's a bunch of other freebies in there that'll help you get your business up and running as well.

Dr. Destini Copp [00:21:19]:

And I will make sure that all of those links are in the show notes. And Jess, thank you so much for joining us today.

Jess Van Den [00:21:26]:

My absolute pleasure. Thanks for having me.